• Greddan@feddit.org
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    11 days ago

    Kids are stupid and can’t consent. Doesn’t matter if it’s about receiving hormones, or jesus christ into their hearts.

    • skye@lemmy.world
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      11 days ago

      kind of the reason why puberty blockers are only given after going through specialists that make sure the kid isn’t just being stupid

      • turdas@suppo.fi
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        11 days ago

        This ban, along with similar bans in other countries whose medical system isn’t run by Big Pharma, is being enacted because medical specialists raised concerns about the lack of evidence in support of puberty blockers, as well as their unknown risks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cass_Review

        Trusting the experts is a two-way street; you still have to respect their expertise when they say something you disagree with.

        • toomanypancakes@piefed.world
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          11 days ago

          Did you even read the Wikipedia article you linked? It’s talking up and down it how controversial that study is and how widely it’s been criticized by pretty much every organization that’s ever worked with a trans person.

          Don’t be lazy.

          • turdas@suppo.fi
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            11 days ago

            Of course such organizations would criticize the study; they are ideologically predisposed to doing so. The broader consensus is still in support of the study. Several other European countries have done their own reviews with pretty much the same findings. Not all of them have resulted in outright bans like in the UK and now NZ, because sometimes adjusting prescription guidelines is enough, depending on how the local medical processes work.

            • dockedatthewrongworf@aussie.zone
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              11 days ago

              Except as I’ve linked in another comment to this thread this is not supported by the peak medical bodies in New Zealand who primarily work with puberty blockers. Unless you’re suggesting that the colleges are “ideologically predisposed”.

        • skye@lemmy.world
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          11 days ago

          the cass review is famously idiotic by now. also mentioning “big pharma” lol.

          i will trust any expert that does research and makes sure their research is of quality. Maybe you should listen to your own advice and listen to the experts (actual ones) you disagree with

          • turdas@suppo.fi
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            11 days ago

            the cass review is famously idiotic by now.

            According to a minority of experts.

            also mentioning “big pharma” lol.

            Lack of medical regulation is very much a big pharma interest.

            I’m not going to bother arguing with you about this because it is clearly an ideological issue for you where you personally consider the (as of yet) difficult to quantify benefits of this medication vastly more important than the numerous possible side effects of messing with the endocrine system of an immature body. Healthcare experts in pretty much every European country caution their use, all for the same reasons as those cited in the Cass report. As such a ban (well, in this case moratorium really) is clearly justifiable.

            • skye@lemmy.world
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              11 days ago

              it’s clearly justifiable to have children grow up and kill themselves due to gender dysphoria and irreversible body changes instead of giving them the choice to delay the puberty, with an onset of manageable effects, you’re right!

              your own wiki page reads all about how the cass report is questionable btw, from critics to research to everything. not just a “minority of experts”.

              • turdas@suppo.fi
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                11 days ago

                Do not put words in my mouth to present a false dilemma.

                Naturally I hope this medication is found to be safe for this purpose after further study. However, these processes are stringent for a reason, because the possibility of it proving to be unsafe after being in widespread use for many years could have disastrous consequences on the health of a large number of people. The history of medicine is full of such cautionary tales.

                • skye@lemmy.world
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                  11 days ago

                  The health consequences, as I said, is something we can deal with as we figure out safer methods for puberty blocking if that turns out to be the case.

                  I’d rather take puberty blockers being unsafe, find out better ways to deal with this problem later on, and deal with the health problems of existing patients over the alternative.

                  The alternative is having no patients to treat from puberty blocker issues, because the dysphoria got to them.

                  You could make the case for any medicine we use in mental healthcare: we don’t understand the risks and longterm effects, but it usually ends up that “adverse health effects way down the line” is preferable to “preventable suicide”.

                  People spout this same bullshit to be anti vaccines, anti fluorine in water, anti everything they don’t fully understand.

                  NOTHING. And I mean NOTHING in medicine is ever going to be 100% safe or won’t have side effects or always be understood.

                  But if you think banning life-saving medicine is better because “what if these people suffer from health issues later” idk what to say.

    • grue@lemmy.world
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      11 days ago

      Kids are stupid and can’t consent.

      Right, which is the entire fucking point of blocking puberty: to put off the issue until they can consent!

      The least-risky/least-permanent option is to give them the blockers, not withhold them from them! I am sick and tired of conservatives’ ass-backward nonsense trying to pretend the opposite.